New Vid - Free-Play in gambesons with Federschwerter

[John_Clements]

See:
http://www.thearma.org/Videos/FreePlayatIDSOct07.mp4

Look close for actual edge / point on target contact.

[JeremyDillon]

I love the energy in this clip. I only wish I could duplicate it in my own practice. How do you guys maintain an acceptable level of safety while still practicing with such impressive intent with steel swords? I suppose it's just a level of control acquired through years of practice, but if there is a secret, I'd love to know .

[John_Clements]

How do you guys maintain an acceptable level of safety while still practicing with such impressive intent with steel swords? .

Practice. Practice. Practice.

Structured drills & preset exercise routines are not enough to develop the spontaneous fluidity and acute perception necessary for the adversarial counter-timing needed in mock combat bouts. That's why sparring is so revealing of true skill. It puts it all together and so is the closest you can come to what happens in earnest combat.

Safe but realistic preparation of a fighter for real combat is the entire function of training. No means achieves this better than dealing with an uncooperative opponent—that is, by fencing them in free-play. When different practitioners have dissimilar drills and exercises and disparate practice routines only sparring can reveal their distinctions and honestly gauge their relative skill. There’s no way to make excuses around it.

JC

ps
we changed the link above to a new larger better resolution .mp4 version of this clip. A full HD version may become available sometime in the future as well.

[Jeremiah.Phipps]

I don't know how you can "play" without (at least) eye-protection.

Jeremiah

[Jeremiah Backhaus]

Practice, Jeremiah, practice.

When you practice without armour you learn to move better. You wouldn't have eye protection if you were fighting for your life, why should you have it in practice? If you had the protection in practice chances of freaking in the face of true combat would be almost a given, and cause you pretty much an immediate loss. I know the first time I stood across from an opponent with steel I nearly wet myself. And we were doing preset drills.

I do not think you should start with steel. Both John and Aaron are excellent fighters, so they have the ability to do this well. I do it (freeplay) mostly with plastic, I feel safer that way. But I do use steel every once and a while, just so that I can hope to attain their level of proficiency.

-Jeremiah (GFS)

[Corey Roberts]

Nice, how does historical clothing/footwear affect the over all feel of things? does it cause any alteration in the performance of techniques?

[Aaron Pynenberg]

Hey Jeremiah, I can understand your comments about safety, and I agree it's very important. These concerns are of course something to consider. The move that you have so deftly shown, again and again is more of a entering technique than an actual thrust. John's skills are so tuned in that I am forced to use a little tighter distance than I would use with a novice, so while that move looks like a thrust, it really is not.

In regards to the historical garb, I really had no problems moving in the garb, the boots were not mine, so they were a little tight, but once the fight started I forgot all about it.

In ARMA, you will find that senior Members, will from time to time fight in a manner which some find or percieve as dangerous. In reality I feel very safe and comfortable fencing with these members. It is the beginer, and intermediate that sometimes causes me concern. That should not surprise anyone, as the masters discuss these points often.

[Randall Pleasant]

If one watches the images one can clearly see that Arron is not thrusting with his hands. The moment of his sword matches the moment of his body.

[Matt Bryant]

If Aaron Had extended his hands, he would have landed the thrust. A good show if control, there.

[John_Clements]

I don't know how you can "play" without (at least) eye-protection.

Jeremiah

We play the same our ancestors did: with control and expert practice, and not targeting the face. Japanese stylist do the same thing in their weapon arts.

...And that thrust was toward my shoulder not at my face.

"It's a rule of martial arts and athletics that non-experts cannot often perceive let alone fathom how experts perform..."

[Jeffrey Hull]

John,

Splendid video.

This seems an opportune moment to ask a question that must be of interest to many fencers:

Do you have any advice to offer fencers as to how they may decide that they are ready for sparring with steel blunts?



Thanks,

[John_Clements]

John,
Do you have any advice to offer fencers as to how they may decide that they are ready for sparring with steel blunts?

It's far easier than it at first would seem. You would be surprised. The control you get with a good steel blunt is superior to any stick or other simulator. The tool simply handles like it was supposed to, making you more accurate and letting proper technique occur naturally.

The more realistic the practice sword the better a swordsman you can be.
It's like a marksman using a firearm that is more accurate. He can't help but hit his target more reliably. He can't argue that he is a better shooter with a gun that doesn't quite fire right, no matter how use to it he may be. Just as well, the sloppier you are and the more inept you are with a more realistic and accurately handling weapon the quicker you will realize it.

JC

[Mike Cartier]

when we cam back from the Intl Gathering we started doing some bare blunt steel and wood, we had always used minimal pads but used a mask. Taking the mask off changed thefight considerably. Makes you a better fighter in my opinion and of course its much more like our ancestors way of doing things.

Eye protection would be ideal, but its hard to find eye protection that can withstand a steel sword, nothing substitutes for control, thats why you have to trust your partner.

[Rod-Thornton]

when we cam back from the Intl Gathering we started doing some bare blunt steel and wood, we had always used minimal pads but used a mask. Taking the mask off changed thefight considerably. Makes you a better fighter in my opinion and of course its much more like our ancestors way of doing things.

Eye protection would be ideal, but its hard to find eye protection that can withstand a steel sword, nothing substitutes for control, thats why you have to trust your partner.

When you begin to spar in earnest with blunted steel, do you set any pre-spar rules, such as "no thrusting" or anything else beyond the obvious avoidance of a crisp zwerch to the head and/or face? Or do you instead rely upon "pulled" thrusting and such? As you stated, blunted steel will give more realism, techniques will play more realistically, and as Mike stated, the added vulnerability of mask-less controlled freeplay ratchets up the required spirit of performance substantially. While I have done blunt steel freeplay with Matt & Shane here in VAB, I've not done any without a mask on...

[Jeremiah Backhaus]

I have never done steel work with a mask on. I have done some light free-play with Aaron Pynenberg and Kevin Peterson in Appleton. We would say before we begin something like 75% just as a starter. Like was said before, trusting your partner is paramount here. And knowing that you have a weapon in your hand, it is just an unspoken rule that thrusting to the face and neck are off limits, and if you do thrust, pull it.
Doing touch/press with steel this last weekend, I accidently got Kevin in the side of the right knee. About 15-20 minutes later, he was still rubbing the area I got. These are blunted to be saf-ER but they are not 100% safe. So the #1 thing to remember is control.
I think taking the mask off for steel training is extremely important. You can't get the feel for a fight if you are completely safe. And you can't devlope control and responsibility for your partner's training if they are completely padded. When there is the possiblilty of injury care and control must go up. And then some real learning takes place and we all get better.

-Jeremiah (GFS)