Kicking while sparring

[Travis Beamon]

I was recently reading the article by Gene on using kicks while in free play or sparring. Obviously kicking was used to some extent during swordplay historically, but I have never personally used a kick effectively in sparring, nor really have I tried. Its not something that has ever occured to me when I have a sword in my hand. The only case I've seen a kick being used effectively is on the video on the main ARMA page "Coup d'groin"

After reading it I've been trying to think of instances where I might use a kick. Has anyone used kicking effectively other than say leg sweeps and such during sparring?

[Allen Johnson]

Like any technique, it should be used whenever it fits. Obviously if you are in your opponents line of attack an attempt at a kick probably wont work too well. However, if you have traversed to the right and have your opponents blade controlled to your inside his knee (probably best not to kick directly on the knee) should be pretty open unless he does what he is supposed to and moves to his right.

[Randall Pleasant]

I was recently reading the article by Gene on using kicks while in free play or sparring. Obviously kicking was used to some extent during swordplay historically, but I have never personally used a kick effectively in sparring, nor really have I tried. Its not something that has ever occured to me when I have a sword in my hand. The only case I've seen a kick being used effectively is on the video on the main ARMA page "Coup d'groin"

After reading it I've been trying to think of instances where I might use a kick. Has anyone used kicking effectively other than say leg sweeps and such during sparring?

Travis

I would think that kicks are best made when your sword is in a bind with the adversary's sword. From a bind, a front thrusting kick could be very effective. Of couse, kicks to the knees (shown in Fiore and other manuals) are very effective but are so damaging that they should never be used in sparring.

[Will Adamson]

What is the current practice in regards to kicking and punching? This seems like one of those things that there would really be a fine line to walk when balancing authenticity with safety.

I would think that most of the kicks that would be useful wouldn't be too damaging to the torso when done in close. The head is usually helmeted, thus pretty well protected (not like many folks would be capable of kicking a standing opponent!). The legs would be the most vulnerable area, but damage to the knee would be very easy, painful, expensive, and would take a person out of training for quite a while.

[Allen Johnson]

I feel its just like striking with your waster. Once you build up the muscle memory its possible to hit with full speed but not full strength. You can limit punches and kicks to very fast pops that keeps with the speed of bouting but still keeps everyone in relative saftey. Though it should be understood that continual practice like this without doing any full stregnth punches and kicks on a bag or something, might lead to an incorrect view of how it works.

[JeffGentry]

What is the current practice in regards to kicking and punching? This seems like one of those things that there would really be a fine line to walk when balancing authenticity with safety.

I would think that most of the kicks that would be useful wouldn't be too damaging to the torso when done in close. The head is usually helmeted, thus pretty well protected (not like many folks would be capable of kicking a standing opponent!). The legs would be the most vulnerable area, but damage to the knee would be very easy, painful, expensive, and would take a person out of training for quite a while.

I am good for giving people a pop in there mask with the heel of my hand, and i will grab mask like i would hair when it is pretty close, I tend to stay away from actualy kicking people when sparring.


Jeff

[Benjamin Smith]

I've won quite a few fights with kicks and punches. You can only throw them from close binds, usually when your opponent's point is actually beyond your body (note: this can occur 3-4 ft away if he's extended), and are only really advisable if there is a serious chance that he can counter what you would do with your weapon (weapons are more effective than a punch or a kick after all. Again pop without force, but with the placement, intent, contact, and time on target, to let them know it was good, and practice with force somwhere else. My feel is that the best targets are the Knee, Ankle, Solar Plexus, Groin, Neck, Ribs, and Face (most of these should not be done with force if they don't have some form of protection).

These (like other aspects of grappling) are also good to use when cross-training with other martial art/sport/wierdos, they have a tendency to really impress people. It's sort of like saying "I don't need a sword to defeat you." Just let your actions do all the talking.

[Will Adamson]

Ben, are you saying that you count these as hits like with a weapon? I just read Gene's article and he clearly states that these are harassing techniques. I'm assuming what you were implying is that you followed up these strikes with weapon hits or got someone into a grappling hold where they tapped out.

[Jaron Bernstein]

I believe there are front stomp kicks to the knee in Gladitoria for harnisfechten if memory serves. I see that as more of a disabling move than a nuisance.

[Benjamin Smith]

Forgive the lack of specificity. In this context when I said "fight x was won with punches or kicks" I meant A) I had his arms wrapped, weapon bound, and proceeded to pummel him, gently of course, until he tapped out, B) had landed a kick or punch hard enough to knock my opponent off his feet and he conceded, or C) had followed up a blow that distracted/stunned my opponent with a disabling blow from a weapon.

Sorry about the misunderstanding.

[david welch]

Wait until you are in a hard bind. When the other guy starts to disengage to strike or grapple, give him a stomp kick to the midsection to send him back and open up the range a little and follow it with a crossing or a wrath strike. I do that every now and then, but I learned it from Jake Norwood who uses it very effectively. He's sneaky like that.

[Jake_Norwood]

D'oh! I was just about to suggest that.

Seriously, I use the stomp kick very, very freqently. It's easy to train, is unexpected, and it's safe to use in sparring (as opposed to some kicks, sweeps, etc., which endanger the fragile joints of the leg). When doing a stomp or kick to the knee, for example, I really only just place the foot there and withdraw, much like "pretending" to eye gouge when grappling. Remember that sparring isn't about "winning," it's about practice...so if you try something that's dangerous but perform it safely (and in doing so get whacked), that's okay. No one should really be keeping score, you know?

Jake

[Will Adamson]

Wait until you are in a hard bind. When the other guy starts to disengage to strike or grapple, give him a stomp kick to the midsection to send him back and open up the range a little and follow it with a crossing or a wrath strike. I do that every now and then, but I learned it from Jake Norwood who uses it very effectively. He's sneaky like that.

That's no way to treat your wife!

[Travis Beamon]

Thanks for the replys and suggestions/advice guys. I'll definately keep kicking to some extent in mind whilst training in the future. Even if i don't use it extremely frequently during sparring. I'm going to the dagger class hosted in Houston on saturday so I'll have to consult with Gene a bit if we find some time.

[JeffGentry]

Thanks for the replys and suggestions/advice guys. I'll definately keep kicking to some extent in mind whilst training in the future. Even if i don't use it extremely frequently during sparring. I'm going to the dagger class hosted in Houston on saturday so I'll have to consult with Gene a bit if we find some time.

Well now in a Dagger fight I am alot more likely to use low kick's.

Jeff